High Strangeness: The UFO Story That Can't Be Killed

Friday, December 29, 2017

The UFO Story That Can't Be Killed

Have you been having fun watching the current UFO news blitz since it was kicked off by the now-famous New York Times article co-written by Leslie Kean? I know I have!

Half the fun for me has come from monitoring the chatter between UFO people, following along with their thoughts on the news and trying to square the flood of information with what they (we) think or thought we knew not just about UFOs but about our government's response to the phenomenon.
One of the two "Nimitz videos"

I'm in the middle of a great correspondence with UFO scholar and blogger at https://ufopast.com/ Professor Greg Eghigian about the UFO story that won't die, and I thought I'd share some of our talk here on High Strangeness.

Greg directed me to a story he just penned for the Smithsonian Air & Space Magazine that you can read here, and he told me that he is, like many of us I think, approaching the news cautiously... In other words, he finds it interesting but he has a lot of questions.

Greg then asked for my take on the story, and here's what I wrote to him:
hi Greg,
I'm having a hard time sorting it all out. On the one hand, I'm happy that UFOs are now headline news in the mainstream media, and that the story does not seem to be dying out. Hell, even Neil deGrasse Tyson is sounding a little on guard and off balance these days. On the other hand, I'm disappointed that most "experts" and commentators have had the classic knee-jerk reaction of going directly to the extraterrestrial alien spacecraft hypothesis to explain what's going on. That's not the only possible explanation, simply the easiest and most acceptable (relatively speaking).
This doesn't really seem to be a case of the Pentagon discovering incontrovertible proof that we are being visited by aliens from other worlds. Rather, it seems more like a somewhat deniable admission that the military has been keeping its eyes open, and has seen some inexplicable things as a result, which is hardly "Disclosure," and hardly shocking. I find the Nimitz videos more confusing than confirming. Why does one pilot say, "There's a whole fleet of them" when only one object is visible? Why does the object shake and wobble in unison with the body of the camera, as if locked to the camera? Why does it never grow closer, or recede?

And the list of people involved is insane.... Robert Bigelow? Tom DeLonge? Harry Reid? Leslie Kean? How do we make sense of that list of players?? I made the point on tv last week that Bigelow had a similar partnership with MUFON around the same time frame as the Pentagon study, and that in his deal with MUFON he would get to keep any artifacts or technologies recovered from their UFO investigations. Did he have the same deal with Reid? (and did he use some of Reid's $22 earmark to pay off MUFON?) Again, this approach to the story presupposes that they're dealing with "nuts-and-bolts" technology, and that the UFOs are manufactured objects. Where's the proof of that?

It also seems to me that the story in its entirety is being very carefully and very professionally managed. I have no idea who might be doing this or why, but my gut tells me that this may the most important aspect of the story, as we know it thus far.

Maybe it's Fox's way of publicizing the upcoming return of The X-Files! Could it all be smoke and mirrors??
 Now, readers, what's your take?

61 comments:

Anonymous said...

If you go to Jon Rappoport's website, he gives a concise biography of the people that Tom DeLonge has in his group. You can split them down to two main groups. 1. Military/Intelligence types. 2. Biology/Genetics/Immunology.

Rappoport's guess is that you shouldn't be shocked if a threat is devised where alien biology will cause harm to the human race. In rush the military and the spooks to save the day. Not a bad theory in my estimation.

purrlgurrl said...

Sigh. Though the project sounds like it was well-funded to us "civilians", it was actually given chump change that wouldn't allow it to do much actual research.

The program received a little over $4 million per year, most of which probably went to staff salaries and benefits as well as contracting firms. If it had an office, there was rent, utilities, equipment, internet, electronic devices (tablets, smartphones, laptops or notebooks), and supplies (gotta keep 'em in coffee and powdered creamer). That's a big chunk of the annual funding.

Then, if the program purchased and retro-fitted a building to house recovered "alien" artifacts, that's an even bigger chunk of its funds.

My guess is that like Blue Book, it didn't have enough resources or funding to do more than collect reports and images.

In truth, the whole enterprise looks and smells like pork barrel and boondoggle to me.

purrlgurrl said...

" . . . most of which probably went to staff salaries and benefits as well as contracting firms."

Meant to say "most of which probably went to staff salaries and benefits as well as contracting firms and consultants."

Mark OC said...

Idle thinking here... I wonder, in the 5 years Elizondo's program was alleged to be in operation, how many UFO reports could they have investigated? Since we know that the project was focused on UFO events involving military personnel, we can assume that the number of cases was relatively small and select. We can also assume that they were "good" cases, i.e., well documented, and involving credible, fairly dependable witnesses. Does that suggest that these guys are sitting on a UFO pot of gold that they refuse to share?

Anonymous said...

One term I have yet to hear is ‘craft retrieval.’ I have a hard time believing that a team merely went out and researched only sightings. Somewhere along the line these people had to retrieved more than just artifacts. Some group has to have a craft in their possession. The public is being spoon fed info on UFOs. It’s hard to say when we are going to get the real truth, if ever.

Mark OC said...

I don't know, it's a huge leap to go from retrieving "artifacts" to having "a craft in their possession." I mean, they seem to be claiming that they have alien artifacts that are being stored in a modified Bigelow Aerospace building, but an artifact can be anything or nothing, and who's to say that it's alien? The burden of proof is on them, and they don't seem to be in any hurry to produce proof.

Meanwhile, there are lots of great bargains to be found at the To The Stars Academy online store!

Anonymous said...

I do need an alien head keychain...

purrlgurrl said...

Mark - I don't think we can assume they were "good" cases. It's a constantly repeated fallacy by UFO true believers that military and police are "better witnesses". Every human being is susceptible to his preconceptions, and in some situations emotions can take over and temporarily cloud judgement even for the most objective of us. That's basic human nature. The police and military are fallible human beings, not machines.

I would bet they looked only at cases that went beyond just a visual sighting report.

But the real question is, how many of the examined cases did they reject as a misidentification of something terrestrial and/or technical glitch?

Mark OC said...

All fair points, purrlgurll! I guess what I meant to say was not that they were the best cases but that they could presumably be better documented than the average civilian case. But even assuming that can get you in trouble!

Bill Pilgrim said...

- In an interview with an investigative reporter for KLAS-TV (Las Vegas), during the week after the stories broke, Harry Reid said the program generated volumes and volumes of written reports that remain classified.
- At it's peak, the program had more than 40 scientists and technicians working at Bigelowe's Nevada facility, not only analyzing data from the military but sending out "rapid response teams" to the scenes of apparently significant UFO incidents.
- No one said anything about recovered crafts, but there are several references in the various stories to "mysterious material" collected from UAP's. I'm figuring from landing sites and stuff ejected while in flight. There are historical cases of this being observed. Jacques Vallee has been on a quest to collect this stuff. One of the reporters who wrote the original NY times article told Vanity Fair: "It's some kind of compound they don't recognize."
- Harry Reid also said the investigators scrutinized some reports of UAP incursions at Air Force ICBM bases. (Enter Robert Hastings' forty years of research re. UFO's & Nukes. Was he consulted? I don't know.)
- Doesn't it seem strange that most of the data they analyzed reportedly came from the military...when the military supposedly stopped UFO investigations in 1969? I don't think they'd be looking at incidents from the 50's & 60's.
- The investigators also reportedly reviewed numerous classified films. Just imagine how much fighter jet gun-camera footage and radar tapes are out there. I'm betting a lot.
- Reid also told the KLAS-TV reporter that the program was defunded partly due to fear, fear not only of the stigma attached to the subject, but fear based on religious beliefs among military and intelligence personnel that the UAP phenomenon might be "demonic" or "satanic."
Wait... What? Yes. That's an issue for another time.
- Finally, there will always be those among us convinced that no one's powers of observation (even the most highly trained and experienced) will ever be as good and accurate as their own.

Bill Pilgrim said...

Addendum: Judging by the levels of incredulity in this post and comments - that's not a criticism but an observation - burning questions arise: What would be the point, or the purpose, of the first stories (NY Times, Washington Post, Politico.com) that revealed this program?
The establishment media have not covered the subject in a serious manner for nearly 50 years. Why now?

purrlgurrl said...
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Dave said...

What most people forget or don't know is that the CIA has a large hand in what stories are run in media companies like the Washington Post, the NY Times, Fox News etc. This UFO business is being manipulated by others outside the media. I wouldn't even hazard a guess as to what the end game is. I would think it is not in the general public's benefit, no matter how it plays out.

purrlgurrl said...
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purrlgurrl said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
purrlgurrl said...

James Carrion and Jack Brewer have some very interesting things to say about some UFO events being "manufactured" by the intelligence community.

The Washington Post now belongs to Amazon, so you can consider its agenda as Jeff Bezos' personal agenda. Maybe he's got a big inventory of UFO books gathering dust. LOL.

nsurround said...

In Mark O'connell's book The Close Encounters Man there is the J. Allen Hynek quote "I have begun to feel that there is a tendency in 20th-century science to forget that there will be a 21st-century science, and indeed, a 30th-century science, from which vantage points our knowledge of the universe may appear quite different. We suffer, perhaps, from temporal provincialism, a form of arrogance that has always irritated posterity". I think we do indeed suffer from this arrogance as promoted by the likes of Neil deGrasse Tyson, Seth Shostak and others who promote science in vary confined terms and who see the UFO phenomena as a subject outside of real scientific inquiry. Based on the historical record of this phenomena the new release of military incidents should not come as a surprise. However we have become so dumb ed down in so many ways about UFO's in general that it is also not a surprise that the public's and mainstream media reaction is now wholly subdued. Quite in contrast to the early years of 'flying saucer' history. What ever the reason(s) for the DOD's release of video footage there has been no major earth quake of public or scientific reaction that would move things forward into the inquiry of what has been going on with this phenomena. We really need another J. Allen Hynek and others like him but that is not the reality of the current situation.

Mark OC said...

Good reminders from all that UFO events have been engineered, managed and manipulated by the government for a very long time (often with the unwitting help of gullible UFO researchers).

One of my prized UFO possessions is a scan of a letter given to me by someone I was interviewing in the course of a MUFON "investigation." This 1952, 6-page handwritten letter from a young airman in the USAF described his role in a government operation involving downed alien spacecraft and their dead aliens crews. The letter is legit, and impeccably detailed, right down to the 1952 California postmark and the sketch of the UFO on the last page... and yet the story is demonstrably fake. The gov't was messing with the mind of this kid and dozens of his colleagues, or so it would seem. But to what end? I still pull that letter out now and then and read it and marvel at the craft that went into what is clearly a hoax...

Anonymous said...

I wonder if these servicemen were being manipulated just like people are currently being pushed into believing there might be an alien threat. What better way to get the populace into line. It sure wouldn't be the first time the 'government' has lied.

Mark OC said...

They were definitely being manipulated, and by sending the letter this one serviceman was manipulating his friend! There must have been many other letters written by the other airmen, too... It seems as if the airmen were being given just enough information to be put off balance, but not enough to prove anything, which would make them reluctant to tell anyone about any further UFO experiences they may have.

Dave said...

I still wonder what the end game was. The military could easily have silenced those airmen. Was it some sort of test or just trying to cause disinformation amongst the ranks.

Mark OC said...

Was the airman allowed to write and send the letter? Did he think he was getting it out behind the backs of his handlers? Maybe he was, or maybe the handlers knew what he was doing and let him believe that he was getting away with something?

Bill Pilgrim said...

Many years ago a friend of mine was unintentionally caught up in what, in hindsight, can be called an elaborate hoax staged to discredit someone.
The victim was a programmer/reporter at a well known FM radio station in the Bay Area. His show topics often veered well beyond political material into "marginal" realms, especially the subject of UFO's. He interviewed many well known names in Ufology.
The hoax involved an alleged human-alien hybrid, an adolescent female, who was supposedly on the run (with her sympathetic handler) from nefarious government agents. The radio guy was somehow convinced of her authenticity and went to work contacting friends & acquaintances (my friend among them) to find safe-houses for her to stay in. He even made veiled references to the affair on his show.
After a couple weeks of the running around, and hiding her, and mysterious black SUV's following, the whole drama ended when she and her handler and the SUV's just disappeared...poof!...never to be seen again.
The poor guy was left with a career nearly in ruins, and several alienated friends. (pun intended)
...
I had it from someone who I consider a knowledgable source that for many years there has been a ultra-secret team - comprised mainly of former special forces soldiers - whose modus operandi has been to stage various hoaxes designed to denigrate the idea of an ET presence and create an atmosphere of fright. The cattle mutilations are just one tactic in their bag of tricks.
Steven Greer (Disclosure Project) claims he has personally interviewed three former soldiers (separately) who all told him they were on a team that staged phony alien abductions of citizens from all walks of life, including government office holders.
...
Well, maybe the above is true. Maybe that, too, is a hoax. Where I'm heading is...after decades of official secrecy, disinformation and propaganda, the UFO subject in the US is today a huge Gordian Knot of warring voices, competing camps, battling cliques, conspiracies, suspicion, distrust, wild delusions and just plain twisted thinking.
Sometimes I think perhaps the only thing that could shake out all the detritus, separate the wheat from the chaff, get people's thinking to line up, is a major spectacular international UFO incident that not even the most hardened could gainsay.
I know, I know. Dream on, Bill.
But in my world..."hope springs eternal."

Dave said...

As far as Disclosure is concerned, the topic is always looked at from human terms. If an alien culture were here and wanted to make their presence known, they have had ample time and opportunities to do so. I can only assume they wish to stay silent and out of the picture. Frankly, I couldn't blame them.

Mark OC said...

I've always felt the same way, Dave. "Disclosure" is, was, and always will be solely in the hands (or other appendages) of the aliens. I made that point to Richard Dolan at a MUFON meeting once and he just snapped back, "Well, the aliens haven't announced disclosure yet, have they?" As if that proved anything.

Dave said...

Mark, the problem is Dolan has written Disclosure books. He can't let the gravy train dry up. Sorry to say, I lost most of my respect for this guy. When he took the stage for Roswell alien body fiasco, that was the last straw for me.

Bill Pilgrim said...

Dave, Mark,

With regard to disclosure being from the 'visitors' end, suppose there have already been subtle and sublime clues deliberately given...that we are missing or dis-missing.

I can think of some.

Dave said...

Bill, I don't expect a landing on the White House lawn but if an advanced alien race wants to truly contact us, they could go beyond subtle and sublime to get our attention.

nsurround said...

As far as government hoaxes go there may well have been many to either discredit the phenomena or use as a cover up for various purposes etc. However there have been to many unexplained incidents world wide from the past that do not lend themselves to being hoaxes from a government or otherwise. If the latest revelations are a hoax then the DOD is really going out on a limb here and for what ends? I am not sure any major government official has made any real comment about the releases which seems a bit odd. Various government entities have been interested or investigated this phenomena since at least the 40's. But there is no mention of this by Elizondo. It is as if the DOD have just discovered this phenomena and now bringing it to the public notice. All of this based on a threat analysis? It has been labeled a threat before and then buried. What ever is going on here the general public seem unaware of any consequential outcomes or really even care at least for now.

Mark OC said...

Dave, what are these signs??

Anonymous said...

Mark, I don't know what 'signs' you are referring to? Did you mean to address Bill?

Bill Pilgrim said...

Dave, Mark,

The most obvious and well corroborated "signs" are the incursions into nuclear weapons facilities of all types since the 1940's. I've written this before and don't mind repeating: if there's one "pattern language" of intelligent, purposeful, historical UFO activity that is well documented, it's the activity connected to a specific human technology: nuclear fission, in all its applications.

People familiar with this data normally ask: What do they want with our nukes?
Suppose that's the wrong question.
Perhaps the question ought to be: what are they trying to tell us about our nukes?
The accumulated observational data ( from military witnesses) and the physical effects that have occurred to some of our missiles (confirmed by Air Force veterans) indicate a tremendously advanced technology at work.
What if that technology is being employed to monitor and/or ameliorate some kind of invisible hazard in our nuclear technology that our science is not aware of? Perhaps a form of radiation our sensors do not detect?
Robert Hastings (UFO's & Nukes) himself has said he thinks these activities are a deliberate warning message from the 'visitors' that "we are playing with fire."
It's astonishing to me that Hastings' rigorous research hasn't provoked more reflective questions about our nuclear 'stuff.'

...
The more sublime clues...I feign to mention, for it will no doubt incite derision from some. But I contend with full confidence that the majority of crop formations that have been appearing worldwide (but mainly in Southern England) since the 1970's are 'calling cards' from interplanetary envoys.
The scientific proof that they are not man made (with a few exceptions/hoaxes) is too long to get into. But I can point people to it.

Dave said...

Sorry Bill, the information I have read supports the idea that the majority of crop circles are man-made. Just a few percent are unexplained. Those few percent are the circles that should be looked at more closely.

As far as Hastings is concerned, the military would never open themselves up to admitting that the nuclear arsenal is far from safe from outside forces, whatever they are. The general populace has no knowledge of this business. Most people are worried about paying the bills and the mortgage. Aliens attacking missile silos isn't on the radar.

Bill Pilgrim said...

Dave,

We have different sources of information regarding the crop circles.
My information is just the opposite from yours.
We'll just leave it at that.

Of course you're correct about the military and nukes.
It's the 'sanctum sanctorum' of government UFO secrecy.
Why let anyone know?

BTW. Not one of the Air Force officers Hastings has interviewed said they thought the missile tampering was hostile, or an attack.
I've read his book. I've seen his documentary. I've heard him speak.

Mark OC said...

Not sure if I'm doing a good enough job keeping on top of this discussion, but I sure am enjoying it!

I wrote a screenplay a while back about crop circles, and learned that, yes, some are man-made, and some have unknown origins. Both are beautiful and awe-inspiring, but of course we prefer the unexplained variety. The fact that the circles often appear in the Wiltshire District, home of the "sacred sites" of Stonehenge, Avebury, Silbury Hill, not to mention the many ley lines that criss-cross the area, may not ultimately mean much, but it is a tantalizing twist to the story. Is it communication, or is it art?

Dave said...

I’ve often wondered if the local law enforcement could get a handle on those trespassers, just how many ‘unknown’ crop circles would appear.

Bill Pilgrim said...

Mark,

Communication or art? Many of us maintain they're both!
Mathematicians who've studied various formations have found that the proportions and measurements often work out to be pictorial representations of Pi, or the musical scale, or fractals, or the solar system, etc.
One of the most elaborate and complex designs last season was a huge, precise replication of Melchizedek's Seal.
And you're point about the ley lines is significant. Without exception all of the non-hoaxed formations (and that's the vast majority) have tremendous magnetic fields. People who walk into them with magnetometers watch the needles go off the scale, then back down again as they leave the formations.
I don't know of any human technology that can create a powerful magnetic vortex which remains in place permanently without some kind of generator. Do you?
Another curious fact that ought to be kept in mind: The UK Ministry of Defense continues to privately offer bribes to farmers to destroy formations in their fields as soon as they are discovered. Now why would they do that for hoaxes?

Dave said...

Having the UK MoD offering farmers bribes to destroy crop formations would make sense if the government was running some secret program that they wanted to keep hush-hush. I would believe that over the UK government keeping secrets about alien crop circles being manufactured.

Bill Pilgrim said...

...A secret government program...that creates huge and elaborate crop formations in farmers' fields...in the middle of nights..employing an unkown advanced technology...then offering bribes to the farmers to destroy them before anyone discovers them?
...Upon my word! Have we really, truly come very far from the days of Galileo's persecution?!
I'll leave it to others to point out, if they care to, the utter absurdity and inanity of such a contention.

Dave said...

Or we could go the other silly way. There are alien craft who have nothing better to do but to fly around in a farmer’s field at night and make pretty patterns. I find that completely nonsensical in every way possible.

Mark OC said...

Bill, where do you get your information about the MoD paying farmers to destroy crop circles? Wouldn't that imply that the MoD knows who is making the circles, and why, but that they're powerless to stop them?

I say this only semi-facetiously, but... why not cut out the middleman and bribe the "circlemakers" to stop making circles?

Dave said...

Melchizedek's Seal is an eight point star used by various religions, (Mormon, Christian, Jewish etc.) I am unclear why a nonhuman alien race would choose this symbol to make patterns in a field of grain.

On the other hand, I could understand humans making this pattern in a field.

JoseJackson said...

Nice post

Bill Pilgrim said...

Mark,

I've been following this phenomenon closely for nearly thirty years. I've read much material by, and corresponded with, long time researchers and photographers. The information about the bribes is word of mouth from several of them who have gotten to know many of the grain farmers in England. It has also been talked about at Crop Circle conferences over the years. I cannot point you to an article about it, because obviously the farmers aren't broadcasting it.
I've explained hundreds and hundreds of times to many people about the scientific findings which prove the majority of formations cannot be man made. Information the news media and most scientists have ignored. But I won't do it now.
Here's a good article that lays it out:
http://www.unknowncountry.com/insight/true-origin-crop-circles-baffles-scientists-leslie-kean
...
The mainstream, evidence-free orthodoxy is that the majority are hoaxes. Yet decades worth of irrefutable evidence and observational data, collected and corroborated using accepted methodologies and forensic techniques, overwhelmingly shows that with a few exceptions...they are not. And this has been completely ignored by the news media and science.
...
After more than thirty years, and multiple hundreds of formations throughout Europe, in Russia, even in the US, NOT ONE single group has demonstrated they can create these huge, elaborate, geometrically perfect formations...in one night...sometimes in a downpour...with no lights...creating a powerful magnetic field that remains in the formations...and leave behind not one footprint...not one iota of evidence of human activity... and NOT ONE BROKEN PLANT.
...
Dave, you can hang your uneducated 'skepti-bunker' broadsides in other people's shops.
But, brother, not in mine.

Bill Pilgrim said...

Mark,

Here's the full article: http://www.bltresearch.com/published/originbaffles.html

Dave said...

Hey Bill, you brought up the Seal. I described what it is and who is associated with it, humans. I am far from 'uneducated' as you put it. Show us some real proof as to who is creating the circles. Photos of aliens, ufos, humans... anything! It is your woo-woo broadsides that I object to, brother.

Dave said...

As Carl Sagan once said, "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." I have yet to see any evidence. All you have offered is stories.

Bill Pilgrim said...

Dave,

Some of the "extraordinary evidence" is detailed in the article links I provided...
if you could just take your bigoted blinkers off long enough to read them.

No, we've not come very far from Galileo's deniers after all.

I'm through with this.

Vomit out your tiresome cliches all you want.

Dave said...

Well Bill, your true colors have been shown finally. Thank you. I am now 'bigoted' and I 'vomit my tired cliches.' I think you need to look no further than in the mirror. I did look at the website you offered up. It seemed to be about people bilocating. I didn't dig very deep after seeing spirits and bilocating being mentioned. Sorry, I wasn't impressed.

nsurround said...

Gee's crop circles? I am neutral on those. Some human made others probably not so much. In any case I thought the discussion was on the release of the military incidents and the New York Times article about the DOD UFO program. A program that was not supposed to exist for which government officials have denied since the end of Project Blue Book. Why are not more persons investigating the sources and everything else about this story? What is really going on here? Some Ufologist have been screaming for disclosure. Now that they got something they seem perplexed about what to do next.

Bill Pilgrim said...

Dave,

My final words on the matter.

Yes, it's true. I've shown my true colors...and so have you.

I presented irrefutable FACTS about the extraordinary nature of the phenomenon, facts that have been corroborated by decades worth of observational data and accepted forensic techniques, by credible researchers.
I presented an article detailing an analysis by eminent scientists, an analysis published in a peer-reviewed science journal, establishing that the plants were not layed over by any human
technology - mechanical or otherwise.

You have given us nothing but belief-based rebuttals, with not one iota of data or evidence to buttress them.

Sagan was duplicitous. "Extraordinary claims require..." extraordinary research, not denialism.

Dave said...

Bill, you seem to like glossing over the points YOU have raised. The Melchizedek Seal is a man made symbol. It has nothing to do with extraterrestrials. You point out a website where the first link at the top of the page speaks of 'spirits.' The website is about bilocating, WWW.bltresearch.com.

I won't waste my precious time refuting your comments. You have your beliefs and I have mine. Continue wearing your tin foil pointed hat for as long as you need to.

nsurround said...

To Bill & Dave,

The original post that we were supposed to be commenting on was not dealing with Crop Circles or your Belief system(s)!! Don't you get it?

Dave said...

Sorry about that. We tended to veer off on unintended subjects. These things happen. I believe this post has just about run it’s course anyway. I won’t be posting further on this particular subject.

nsurround said...

To Dave,

Was not trying to berate anyone here. Just trying to keep the discussion on topic. I do not mind discussing crop circles etc and both of you had good arguments but thought the thread of sorts was being hijacked from the original topic. Since this is a blog commentary and not a forum the rules if there are any are kind of vague.

Bill Pilgrim said...

Tin foil hats also shield our brains from the truth.
What? ET isn't aware of our meaningful symbology? An short-sighted presumption.
"Won't waste time" refuting the data and published scientific research?
The typical response from pompous a***s who can't back up their arguments.

nsurround,

The thread began from earlier comments about disclosure coming from ET's themselves rather than any government.
There are many who think that rather than a major SHOUT...we've been getting 'whispered' hints all along about the presence of ET. The crop formations being some of them.

Mark OC said...

Folks, I have refrained from adding my 2 cents in this discussion, in part because my position on crop circles is much the same as my position on UFOs: the more I study them, the more I care about what they mean and the less I worry about what they are and who or what made them. I realize it might not be the wisest course to separate the two, and in fact it might make real understanding even more difficult. But that's the way my brain works these days and I'm stuck with it.

My crop circle script, "Doug and Dave," is loosely based on the exploits of two men who became world-famous when they took credit for making all the British crop circles, only to come crashing down to earth when it was revealed that they had not, in fact, made all the crop circles and may not have made ANY of them at all. There was something about the idea that these two men hoaxed a hoax that appealed to me as a storyteller. And the fact that in real life they were both landscape artists just added an extra layer of intrigue for me. In the end my script gives equal shrift to both earthly and unearthly explanations, because it seemed to me (and still does) that both explanations are equally likely, and they can both exist and both be true simultaneously...

Is that a cop-out?

nsurround said...

In regards to the release of these official USG video footage's there was reported to be chain-of-custody (CoC) document(s) supporting the origin of the material. So far no CoC documents has been forth coming. However after inquiring about this with Leslie Kean on her facebook page she say's " Yes we have the document." I then asked "Can you share or publish that document to the public?". As of yet there has been not answer. I then filed a FOIA asking for the supporting documents. Not sure this will come to anything. However the fact that Mrs. Kean say's "we" in her answer suggests that she is part of a group holding the document(s). I also inquired about this on the TTS website via contact page. Their response was "Thank you for your email and your interest in TTS Academy. Please visit our Community of Interest, where we discuss the provenance and source of the video or other information provided." Looking on that section of the website produced nothing about the CoC support documents. I asked again mentioning this and received no further response. There certainly is a very interesting story here at the very least with all the character's involved (Mr. Big, Tom Delonge TTS group, Leslie Kean and some USG entity).


Mark OC said...

I trust Leslie on this, but it is troubling that people repping TTS Academy keep writing checks they can't seem to cash.

nsurround said...

Well yes, Leslie Kean seems ok however her cohorts, whomever they are, may be in it for different reasons. If TTS does hold the documents and trying to get more investors by doling out the info I am not ok with that. It does seem like TTS and Mr. Big look at this as some property they have control over for which to extract money from investors etc. I am not sure that the UFODATA project is connected with all of this. But Chris Mellon is a board member of both entities and Leslie Kean is a board member of the UFODATA project. To date that project has been moving at a snails pace.

Mark OC said...

Dr. Mark Rodeghier, the scientific director of CUFOS, still works with Leslie Kean at times, and I trust Mark's integrity 100%.